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As an adjunct to the Tangents blog, the intention with this forum is to answer any questions, and allow a diverse discussion of topics related photography. With that, see it as an open invitation to just climb in and start threads and to respond to any threads.
Presentation
ikko
Member
Hi all, fair play Neil to have created the forum, hopefully it will be busy.
I just want to know what you guys do in terms of presentation when you show the photos to the couple for the 1st time.
I do a slideshow with music that I show them and then I give them a proof book. The photos are also on my website in a private gallery. i asked them to pick the ones they want in the album, then I do up a layout that I email them for approval.
I just want to know what you guys do in terms of presentation when you show the photos to the couple for the 1st time.
I do a slideshow with music that I show them and then I give them a proof book. The photos are also on my website in a private gallery. i asked them to pick the ones they want in the album, then I do up a layout that I email them for approval.
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Comments
I still give printed proofs. I feel that clients still like the tactile thing of handling an actual photo, rather than clicking through hundreds of images on a gallery.
I do post a gallery of images as well.
At the reception, I hand out 100 bookmarks to various guests. These 8x2 bookmarks with images from the couple's photo session on it, along with a URL to where guests can view the images.
I also make sure to post an album to Facebook with a selection of the best images (usually 40-80 images).
For the album, the clients send me an Excel spreadsheet of the images they want included in the album, and my assistant and I design an album around this selection, adding some, and dropping a few of the images (with a note to the clients). The design is posted on a gallery for them to view and change, and finally approve.
Usually how many proofs? Just usable images? Any processing in those? (100-200-500-1000?)
And how many photos in the final album? (20-50-100-200?)
Cheers.
I only do color balance; exposure; contrast adjustments on the images for proofing.
For enlargements or album designs, I will do further editing like editing out skin blemishes or removing exit signs.
The albums I offer are 24 spreads, and contain 100-120 images.
So you hand out 500 prints with watermark to your clients? That's a lot to go thru.
Regarding the bookmarks, I imagine the images on them are from the pre-wedding shoot you did with the couple. The idea of a bookmark is a good one though. I rely in the couple to spread the word about the online buying facilities of my website which is probably a mistake.
How many is 'enough'? If there is such a thing, and what should you expect to give to your clients? I mean, 500 photos, how many hours would that usually take you, Neil?
Cheers in advanced for the replies,
Sanele
And Sanele - if you are watermarking and colour correcting the photos for an online gallery it's really not that much more effort to print them out as 4x6s.
We use the Zenfolio online gallery which I'm very pleased with, but I'm probably going to go with bringing the couple to us to choose the pics. As Daubs says after calibrating our own monitors to then have the couple pick their album photos on their own screens after all your own colour calibrated hard work is a no no to me. I'd get that bunny in the headlights look if I tried to explain colour calibration to some of my B&Gs.
Sorry for the long winded question! Hopefully someone can help
Cheers,
Sanele
@SaneleChadwick - personally, I do the RAW file edit stuff (contrast, WB, etc) before the clients view the images and then Photoshop (spot removal, liquefy if required, etc.) afterward. Mostly because the Lightroom edit can be done in bulk and so isn't too time consuming.
But it also depends on how many photos are being handed over. If you are presenting 300-400 proofs to the client, RAW editing isn't too bad. If you are presenting 1500 and the client is only going to choose 100 from that, then I wouldn't edit at all until after the first cut by the client. Although, I doubt I would be in that situation where i am now!
Hope it helps!
PS: Personally, I wouldn't be adding a vignette to anything, at most a touch of burning on the edges. xx
An important side-benefit is that with Zenfolio, I have an off-site back-up of all my important JPGs.
You have to consider the extreme what-if scenario of your house being burgled or your house burning down. Would you still have your clients' images? Zenfolio is part of my back-up system.
However, the last wedding I shot (only my second) the bride asked if I could choose the 'best photos' I thought were taken, and send them through. I initially had 400-odd for her to proof, but she just wanted me to choose them. I ended up fully-editing 230-odd, and made a 3-minute slideshow too
I've just send off the disk today, so should hear back from the couple in a few days time. Hopefully it goes well.
I did 2 weddings over Xmas away from home, (250kms) so I'm not going to do my usual presentation that imvolves meeting the couple and present the images on a slideshow and hand out a proofbook.
I was thinking, as it has been mentioned to post them my selection, approx 200 images, on 6x4s and let them choose the ones they want for the album.
What do you think?
should I watermarked them or would it be seem as pettyful?
Thanks
However, printing 6x4 is very cheap these days, and you've only got approx 200, so I would think it's a good idea to get them printed. How many photos will you manage to fit in an album? 100-120?
With regards to the watermark... nah, no need for printed proofs at 6x4. I'd only watermark digital copies if I had too, but it's entirely up to you
I usually fit between 60 and 70 in an album. I offer packages with an 30 page album, I always end up have 3 to 5 extra pages that I charge for and the couple always accept to pay the small extra.
I m always wondering how to offer my services, how do you offer yours, do you have packages or is it "a la carte" ?
As I'm just starting out, shooting all day helps me to build my folio, and build a strong network of happy clients who I can network. Recently I've been picking up some small jobs through friends of people I've shot for - who have then gone and looked at my work and liked what they saw.
I'm trying to keep things very simple, so when people ask 'what do I get, how much, how many etc?' I can safely say X amount and Y this is what you'll get - it does my head in at the moment when there are too many options, lol.
I guess it also depends on what the competition in your area is doing. Is there a massive overload of photographers in Ireland like there is in New Zealand with the digital era?
I had clients mention meeting another photographer in the same town where I am, and being overwhelmed by 4 pages of options and add-ons.
During the wedding when I was shooting the head table from an angle, I remembered your advice about flash ‘equidistance, equidistance, equidistance’ to your subjects, so I immediately tilted my flash head, flagged my flash, and bounced it on a wall that was equidistance to the head table (your photo of the guys in the sombrero’s if I recall correctly) the result was great, even though I was shooting with a ‘cheapo’ zoom.
One day I hope to travel and attend one of your workshops, seeing as New Zealand is too far away :P
example: $2500 for coverage of the day and this includes a stack of proofs, and an album. Do they buy the images to go into that album? or does the album come included, and anything over is ala carte?
Also what about people scanning the proof and trying to print them as larger images?
I've had that happen.
Larry
Basic coverage + whatever they want to add, incl album.
I don't up-sell albums, by starting at a smaller album. I price it for a big album with 24 spreads. Done. I hate haggling. And I just knooooow the born salespeople here will have a conniption at the idea that I am leaving money on the table etc. Whatever.
So my pricing for albums are fixed for a fixed number of pages. I don't limit the nr of images, but I do clearly tell clients the more images they cram in, the more it looks like a fridge door. Fewer images = Larger images. Larger images present better.
Re scanning of proofs. I just let it go should it happen. There are other things to worry about in terms of running a business, than one client flexing goodwill and the agreement per contract.